Let's argue about Religion...I don't get to do that enough!!

[Gonecrazy99]

i must say i do not belive in god or any of that. i belive that when you die your sole is recarnded. i also belive that we have envovled from monkeys thew the years. and if adam and eve were the first living creater on earth then explain diosures for me. plus when religion was first started only the preist were the only ones allowed to have a bible. i do belive that jesus did exiset and was hung, and thoes that were jailed with him came up with what you see in a bible. also for him rising again you have to realize that they lived off the land and who is not to say they did not eat "pot" as we call it, or mushrooms. basicly i think it is all a big hokes. i am vary sorry if i have offened any one but that is what i belive.

[FreakyStylie]

No offense from me either. Just want to say a couple things:
1. Living this life over and over and over again would be hell. Whether it is in different forms or not. Not to mention that a soul would have to be imprisoned to continue the cycle.
2. Adam and Eve were never said to be the first living creatures.
3. Religion came before the Bible. Even Pagans, etc too. And some of the reasons they were the only ones would be that they wanted to study, and there were no printing presses thousands of years ago.
4. It needs to be read in order to argue it. Just like anything else, you have to know both sides to have an arguement.

Originally Posted by Gonecrazy99

i must say i do not belive in god or any of that. i belive that when you die your sole is recarnded. i also belive that we have envovled from monkeys thew the years. and if adam and eve were the first living creater on earth then explain diosures for me. plus when religion was first started only the preist were the only ones allowed to have a bible. i do belive that jesus did exiset and was hung, and thoes that were jailed with him came up with what you see in a bible. also for him rising again you have to realize that they lived off the land and who is not to say they did not eat "pot" as we call it, or mushrooms. basicly i think it is all a big hokes. i am vary sorry if i have offened any one but that is what i belive.

[Jon Collardgreens]

The dinasours are explained w/ fact by Ken Ham.

He has resources that provew the dinasours were
only around 6,000 years before man was made.

& not the milions that those archeologist say.

I could name you a few books that would

shoot down eveloution w/ facts & not neccessarily

bible scripture. There are scientific proof that the

dinasours are not as old as they were made out

to be. Some of the dinasours starved themselves

from eating all the food they could find. They were

over populated So there was not enough food

for all of them. Some did fall into Tarpits. Let me

know if your interested in any educational

resources to read.

[OldMt.Grizzly]

Originally Posted by Gonecrazy99

i must say i do not belive in god or any of that. i belive that when you die your sole is recarnded. i also belive that we have envovled from monkeys thew the years. and if adam and eve were the first living creater on earth then explain diosures for me. plus when religion was first started only the preist were the only ones allowed to have a bible. i do belive that jesus did exiset and was hung, and thoes that were jailed with him came up with what you see in a bible. also for him rising again you have to realize that they lived off the land and who is not to say they did not eat "pot" as we call it, or mushrooms. basicly i think it is all a big hokes. i am vary sorry if i have offened any one but that is what i belive.

No offense taken. You are of course entitled to your own opinions and beliefs. As long as there are no personal attacks, I enjoy an open discussion. To that end, I have a few questions and comments.

1. If you believe that when you die your soul is reincarnated, what is that belief based on?
2. You believe that we evolved from monkeys. Okay, there is absolutely no fossil evidence to support that, if evolution were a reality we would still be seeing it today in the form of transitionary species but we do not. So since evolution actually is contrary to science and not based on faith in a higher power, what is your justification for it?
3. I did not say Adam and Eve were the first creatures on earth. In fact God created man on the 6th day. All the animals had already been created. There is no contradiction here man existed at the same time as dinosaurs. Additionally the Bible does not say how long Adam and Eve were in the Garden of Eden before they sinned and were cast out. At which time the earth was cursed.
4. As for the priests being the only ones allowed to have a Bible, not only does that not fit the facts of “religion” since there are many religions and belief systems and many of them do not follow the teachings of the Bible, but that is not even at the beginning of the Christian faith. Prior to Jesus, not only did the Jewish people have copies of the Torah, the Mishnah (sp?) and the other texts, but from the time they were very young they would be memorizing them. What you are referring to is the practice of the Catholic church during the dark ages. In fact, the Catholic church isn’t even the same as mainstream Christianity. It originated in the first century as an offshoot, lead by a student of one of the twelve original disciples and since it heretically worshipped Mary, came to be known as the cult of Mary (a label often falsely attributed to all Christians). Now let me stop there and clarify, I am not saying that all Catholics are cultists and damned to hell. There are traditions and dogmas within Catholicism that are contrary to scripture, but as I pointed out in my original posting, the most important issues are issues of salvation. So I won’t go into the details now.
5. You do believe that Jesus existed and was hung. Okay, that is a matter of historical documentation (his crucifixion is well documented in Greek and Roman histories) However, you think that the people jailed with him came up with the Bible? That would be very difficult since Jesus was only jailed for less than a week. Even if the people he was jailed with decided to come up with something in that short of a time, how would they write the Old Testament (written thousands of years before Jesus’ birth and widely studied at the time of his life) and how would they manage to incorporate all the fulfilling of prophecy as well as some of the various patterns that have been discovered in the Bible. (The book of Mark contains documented Heptatic structures, i.e. a genealogy that contains seven words found no where else in the book, the number of words divisible by seven, etc… for a super computer to calculate only a few of these would take many years, but over 43 have been found) The heptatic structures are only one example, how do you explain a bunch of convicts or even educated men like Dr. Luke (who wrote the gospel of Luke) to come up with that without divine inspiration.
6. Also, you suggested that perhaps the eye witness accounts of Jesus resurrection was due to a massive ingestion of hallucinogenic drugs, such as shrooms or Marijuana. Okay, let’s forget for just a minute that we are not talking about a bunch of mindless animals grazing in a field but a highly developed society and pretend that it is possible that the food had a mind altering effect. Is it safe to assume that you have tried some kind of drugs? If so you can answer this directly, if not maybe if you know someone who has you can ask them. If you are hanging with a group of your buddies and all using the same drugs, watching the same movie or listening to the same music, will you all have the same experience? Of course not because each person reacts to the drugs in a slightly different way. That is why some people on LSD hear colors and see sounds, while others fly off of a building, and still others completely freak out. So how likely is it that hundreds of people in different locations all had the exact same drug trip. That line of reasoning is not rational.

Let me assure you that I am not the kind of person who just believes whatever sounds good. I take my time, I study and carefully assess the information as well as where it is coming from. Belief in God (YHWH) and His plan of salvation through His Son Jesus, fits the facts far better than any Darwinian flight of fancy.

[FreakyStylie]

Good point! People have no problem with the tradition of the Indian Tribes only passing down a history verbally. That is something seen more recently, but it was the same until, presumably, Moses decided to write them down. Before then, I imagine it as the Indians did.

Originally Posted by OldMt.Grizzly

Prior to Jesus, not only did the Jewish people have copies of the Torah, the Mishnah (sp?) and the other texts, but from the time they were very young they would be memorizing them. What you are referring to is the practice of the Catholic church during the dark ages.

[OldMt.Grizzly]

Also, I read an interesting article about the speed of light. As you may know carbon 14 dating is based on the known quality of the speed at which the radioactive isotope carbon 14 breaks down. (half life) According to this article various tests have shown that the speed of light is not constant but actually be slowing down. As you know from Einstein's theory of relativity as you approach the speed of light, time slows down. Now bear with me here. If light is slowing down, then the break down of carbon 14 would also be slowing down because by the slowing of light we are therefore closer to it's speed. Time measured by morning and evening are a day would still be counted the same, but as evidenced in carbon 14 dating time would be slowing down. So, if the speed of light was much faster 10 to the 10th power at the time of creation carbon 14 dating would accurately report the radiological age of the earth at billions of years, while the morning and evening are a day age would still accurately be much, much younger. Oops, there goes evolution again. The world has not been around long enough for the Billions of years that evolution would take if it were legitimate in the first place.

For more information on some of these fascinating items check out http://www.khouse.org

[OldMt.Grizzly]

Thank you Freaky.

by the way, what part of Oregon are you in? It is kinda rare that I see someone on a board in the same place as me. I usually end up on boards with people in Europe or at least the East coast.

[FreakyStylie]

Not to mention the effect of the magnetic reversal of the poles that have happened throughout time, alternating the amount of light and radiation, and dispursing it over the face of the Earth (not just the poles); the fact of the canopy that used to encompass the Earth; and the fact that the flood covering the entire Earth would create such pressure and heat that it would cause advanced dating in other measurements used to determine dating - not to mention making lots of diamonds .

Originally Posted by OldMt.Grizzly

Also, I read an interesting article about the speed of light. As you may know carbon 14 dating is based on the known quality of the speed at which the radioactive isotope carbon 14 breaks down. (half life) According to this article various tests have shown that the speed of light is not constant but actually be slowing down. As you know from Einstein's theory of relativity as you approach the speed of light, time slows down. Now bear with me here. If light is slowing down, then the break down of carbon 14 would also be slowing down because by the slowing of light we are therefore closer to it's speed. Time measured by morning and evening are a day would still be counted the same, but as evidenced in carbon 14 dating time would be slowing down. So, if the speed of light was much faster 10 to the 10th power at the time of creation carbon 14 dating would accurately report the radiological age of the earth at billions of years, while the morning and evening are a day age would still accurately be much, much younger. Oops, there goes evolution again. The world has not been around long enough for the Billions of years that evolution would take if it were legitimate in the first place.

For more information on some of these fascinating items check out http://www.khouse.org

I am in the Corvallis/Albany area. Where are you at?

Originally Posted by OldMt.Grizzly

Thank you Freaky.

by the way, what part of Oregon are you in? It is kinda rare that I see someone on a board in the same place as me. I usually end up on boards with people in Europe or at least the East coast.

[OldMt.Grizzly]

I am working in Salem. Holy cow, that is close!

[FreakyStylie]

Ah, but with the space/time continuum, it might actually be millennia away.

I thought you must be somewhere around this area with the subjects you have discussed. There (unfortunately) have been quite a few things we experience here that many other states haven't yet. Benton and Multnomah counties' gay marriage licensing; assisted suicide; abortion mania . . . etc. This state certainly is a hotbed for a lot of issues!

Originally Posted by OldMt.Grizzly

I am working in Salem. Holy cow, that is close!