The Atlantic on McCain

Pixsurguy · 09-12-2008, 02:04 PM

For original article, go here: The Daily Dish | By Andrew Sullivan

Andrew Sullivan - The Atlantic

McCain's Integrity
10 Sep 2008 01:40 pm

For me, this surreal moment - like the entire surrealism of the past ten days - is not really about Sarah Palin or Barack Obama or pigs or fish or lipstick. It's about John McCain. The one thing I always thought I knew about him is that he is a decent and honest person. When he knows, as every sane person must, that Obama did not in any conceivable sense mean that Sarah Palin is a pig, what did he do? Did he come out and say so and end this charade? Or did he acquiesce in and thereby enable the mindless Rovianism that is now the core feature of his campaign?
So far, he has let us all down. My guess is he will continue to do so. And that decision, for my part, ends whatever respect I once had for him. On core moral issues, where this man knew what the right thing was, and had to pick between good and evil, he chose evil. When he knew that George W. Bush's war in Iraq was a fiasco and catastrophe, and before Donald Rumsfeld quit, McCain endorsed George W. Bush against his fellow Vietnam vet, John Kerry in 2004. By that decision, McCain lost any credibility that he can ever put country first. He put party first and his own career first ahead of what he knew was best for the country.
And when the Senate and House voted overwhelmingly to condemn and end the torture regime of Bush and Cheney in 2006, McCain again had a clear choice between good and evil, and chose evil.
He capitulated and enshrined torture as the policy of the United States, by allowing the CIA to use techniques as bad as and worse than the torture inflicted on him in Vietnam. He gave the war criminals in the White House retroactive immunity against the prosecution they so richly deserve. The enormity of this moral betrayal, this betrayal of his country's honor, has yet to sink in. But for my part, it now makes much more sense. He is not the man I thought he was.
And when he had the chance to engage in a real and substantive debate against the most talented politician of the next generation in a fall campaign where vital issues are at stake, what did McCain do? He began his general campaign with a series of grotesque, trivial and absurd MTV-style attacks on Obama's virtues and implied disgusting things about his opponent's patriotism.
And then, because he could see he was going to lose, ten days ago, he threw caution to the wind and with no vetting whatsoever, picked a woman who, by her decision to endure her own eight-month pregnancy of a Down Syndrome child in public, that he was going to reignite the culture war as a last stand against Obama. That's all that is happening right now: a massive bump in the enthusiasm of the Christianist base. This is pure Rove.
Yes, McCain made a decision that revealed many appalling things about him. In the end, his final concern is not national security. No one who cares about national security would pick as vice-president someone who knows nothing about it as his replacement. No one who cares about this country's safety would gamble the security of the world on a total unknown because she polled well with the Christianist base. No person who truly believed that the surge was integral to this country's national security would pick as his veep candidate a woman who, so far as we can tell anything, opposed it at the time.
McCain has demonstrated in the last two months that he does not have the character to be president of the United States. And that is why it is more important than ever to ensure that Barack Obama is the next president. The alternative is now unthinkable. And McCain - no one else - has proved it.

hortysir · 09-12-2008, 05:11 PM

McCain chose to stay the course in Iraq because more would die if we didn't. Only AFTER crossing the border and toppling Saddam was it clear that intel was wrong. By then it was too late.
Kerry wanted to cut-n-run and abandon the Iraqi's at the worst possible time.
Palin knows plenty about Nat'l Security. As CIC of the ANG and as governor of a state armed with Asia-pointed missle defense.
.
.
How does Barry Nobama stack up in these areas? How is better suited for the highest office in our country during these most troubling times?

Iceman · 09-13-2008, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hortysir

McCain chose to stay the course in Iraq because more would die if we didn't. Only AFTER crossing the border and toppling Saddam was it clear that intel was wrong. By then it was too late.
Kerry wanted to cut-n-run and abandon the Iraqi's at the worst possible time.
Palin knows plenty about Nat'l Security. As CIC of the ANG and as governor of a state armed with Asia-pointed missle defense.
.
.
How does Barry Nobama stack up in these areas? How is better suited for the highest office in our country during these most troubling times?

Maybe with his job while being a community organizer, he gained a lot of experience in National Security...lol

Flynn · 09-13-2008, 08:30 AM

McCain as a POW gained a lot of experience at being at being a Sadomasochist with homosexual tendencies I don't see how that qualifies him for the top job and as for Palin she is running as VP and her input on national security issues will not be required.

Palin the pig woman will only have influence if McCain the homosexual drops dead.

She will have no influence at all when the Republicans loose.

Itsnotgonnaspankitself... · 09-13-2008, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hortysir

...Only AFTER crossing the border and toppling Saddam was it clear that intel was wrong.

You actually believe that...???

With what America spends on "Intelligence", you actually believe they didn't know better PRIOR to crossing the border...

really?

Or is it more that you would *like* to believe that...in order to try to justify an unjust act...?

Flynn · 09-13-2008, 08:34 AM

Spanky

The American government claims to be the most technologically advanced and sophisticated nation on the planet yet their intelligence reports on Iraq were WRONG.

Iceman · 09-13-2008, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flynn

McCain as a POW gained a lot of experience at being at being a Sadomasochist with homosexual tendencies I don't see how that qualifies him for the top job and as for Palin she is running as VP and her input on national security issues will not be required.

Palin the pig woman will only have influence if McCain the homosexual drops dead.

She will have no influence at all when the Republicans loose.

Flynn you keep mentioning McCain being a queer just because he was a POW. Do you have any knowledge or proof concerning this or is this just some more of your bullshit?

hortysir · 09-13-2008, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Itsnotgonnaspankitself...

You actually believe that...???

With what America spends on "Intelligence", you actually believe they didn't know better PRIOR to crossing the border...

really?

Or is it more that you would *like* to believe that...in order to try to justify an injustifiable act...?

Out of my entire post of questions, that's all you managed to pull out of it?
I said it wasn't CLEAR until then.
And, if you remember, it was British inteligence that was passed on to us.
But, keep discussing the war/Bush instead of McCain-Obama....

Itsnotgonnaspankitself... · 09-13-2008, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hortysir

Out of my entire post of questions, that's all you managed to pull out of it?
I said it wasn't CLEAR until then.
And, if you remember, it was British inteligence that was passed on to us.
But, keep discussing the war/Bush instead of McCain-Obama....

Well, if we're discussing McCain, then it's still pertinent, since he'll toe the same line as his hero, George Dubya Bush...and drag out this phony war on terrorism in order to make Halliburton even more filthy rich, and to try to justify America's hugely bloated military budget.

Flynn · 09-13-2008, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman

Flynn you keep mentioning McCain being a queer just because he was a POW. Do you have any knowledge or proof concerning this or is this just some more of your bullshit?

Ice

You post comments about Obama that are not based on REALITY.

Obama is not a Muslim and Obama is not a stooge for the Islamic community but it does not prevent you from making BULLSHIT comments about him.

I provided a link that states clearly that USA service personnel have testified under oath on a Christian Bible that they witnessed McCain dress in an effeminate way as a Vietnamese POW to attract men who would have anal sex with him.

09-12-2008, 02:04 PM	#1 (permalink)
Pixsurguy Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 14,314	The Atlantic on McCain For original article, go here: The Daily Dish \| By Andrew Sullivan Andrew Sullivan - The Atlantic McCain's Integrity 10 Sep 2008 01:40 pm For me, this surreal moment - like the entire surrealism of the past ten days - is not really about Sarah Palin or Barack Obama or pigs or fish or lipstick. It's about John McCain. The one thing I always thought I knew about him is that he is a decent and honest person. When he knows, as every sane person must, that Obama did not in any conceivable sense mean that Sarah Palin is a pig, what did he do? Did he come out and say so and end this charade? Or did he acquiesce in and thereby enable the mindless Rovianism that is now the core feature of his campaign? So far, he has let us all down. My guess is he will continue to do so. And that decision, for my part, ends whatever respect I once had for him. On core moral issues, where this man knew what the right thing was, and had to pick between good and evil, he chose evil. When he knew that George W. Bush's war in Iraq was a fiasco and catastrophe, and before Donald Rumsfeld quit, McCain endorsed George W. Bush against his fellow Vietnam vet, John Kerry in 2004. By that decision, McCain lost any credibility that he can ever put country first. He put party first and his own career first ahead of what he knew was best for the country. And when the Senate and House voted overwhelmingly to condemn and end the torture regime of Bush and Cheney in 2006, McCain again had a clear choice between good and evil, and chose evil. He capitulated and enshrined torture as the policy of the United States, by allowing the CIA to use techniques as bad as and worse than the torture inflicted on him in Vietnam. He gave the war criminals in the White House retroactive immunity against the prosecution they so richly deserve. The enormity of this moral betrayal, this betrayal of his country's honor, has yet to sink in. But for my part, it now makes much more sense. He is not the man I thought he was. And when he had the chance to engage in a real and substantive debate against the most talented politician of the next generation in a fall campaign where vital issues are at stake, what did McCain do? He began his general campaign with a series of grotesque, trivial and absurd MTV-style attacks on Obama's virtues and implied disgusting things about his opponent's patriotism. And then, because he could see he was going to lose, ten days ago, he threw caution to the wind and with no vetting whatsoever, picked a woman who, by her decision to endure her own eight-month pregnancy of a Down Syndrome child in public, that he was going to reignite the culture war as a last stand against Obama. That's all that is happening right now: a massive bump in the enthusiasm of the Christianist base. This is pure Rove. Yes, McCain made a decision that revealed many appalling things about him. In the end, his final concern is not national security. No one who cares about national security would pick as vice-president someone who knows nothing about it as his replacement. No one who cares about this country's safety would gamble the security of the world on a total unknown because she polled well with the Christianist base. No person who truly believed that the surge was integral to this country's national security would pick as his veep candidate a woman who, so far as we can tell anything, opposed it at the time. McCain has demonstrated in the last two months that he does not have the character to be president of the United States. And that is why it is more important than ever to ensure that Barack Obama is the next president. The alternative is now unthinkable. And McCain - no one else - has proved it.

09-12-2008, 05:11 PM	#2 (permalink)
hortysir Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: South...Thank God! Posts: 4,523	McCain chose to stay the course in Iraq because more would die if we didn't. Only AFTER crossing the border and toppling Saddam was it clear that intel was wrong. By then it was too late. Kerry wanted to cut-n-run and abandon the Iraqi's at the worst possible time. Palin knows plenty about Nat'l Security. As CIC of the ANG and as governor of a state armed with Asia-pointed missle defense. . . How does Barry Nobama stack up in these areas? How is better suited for the highest office in our country during these most troubling times? __________________

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09-13-2008, 08:30 AM	#4 (permalink)
Flynn Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,270	McCain as a POW gained a lot of experience at being at being a Sadomasochist with homosexual tendencies I don't see how that qualifies him for the top job and as for Palin she is running as VP and her input on national security issues will not be required. Palin the pig woman will only have influence if McCain the homosexual drops dead. She will have no influence at all when the Republicans loose.

09-13-2008, 08:34 AM	#6 (permalink)
Flynn Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,270	Spanky The American government claims to be the most technologically advanced and sophisticated nation on the planet yet their intelligence reports on Iraq were WRONG.