How should the Iraq war be handled?

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#1
There is something that I wish to start a debate about, the Iraq war. I have seen on this forum that various political issues are debated and not once have I see it here. Without further Adu, I am going to start this.

Personally I was against this from the start. Bush relied on his intel which was pretty bad, which caused the preemptive strike. When the war was finished, nothing of what Bush had suspected of Saddam was found. It later turned out that Saddam was just bluffing that he had them so people wouldn't mess with them. Another reason that we could have gone into here, which I am open to, is that Bush wanted to start a "Food for Oil" program to get gas prices down. It seems that has done the oppossite of it.

Now that we are in there, things are a mess and it seems that progress is slow. Insurgents run around the place placing IEDs and other explosive stuff and unleash it on soldiers and civilians alike. It often seems that we often hear a small bit of what is going on from the media.

Soldiers often complain that they don't have anything to go against them. They say they are unprepared and feel at a disadvantage. When they head out, they hear it is going to be a year, later they hear 3 months is going to be added to it and I wouldn't blame them if they get mad.

here is what I have to say

When the democrats took congress, they said that they wanted a bill that would support the troops. I am for that since I believe that they should be prepared for what is out there on the battlefield. I also believe that when they leave, the time that they are told they are going to stay is final, nothing can be changed unless an emergency happens. I also question whether the surge of troops did anything, right now it seems to be pretty nuetral. I also believe that the timetable that should be set, is by the commanders of the forces there. Politicians make horrible war generals ( no offense), and they can make dumb decisions with what to do easily. I think that the generals over there should put the timetable since they are more aware and have more experience in the field as well as know what does what there.

I do think we should continue to support our servicemen and women there, they are doing a big favor for us and we should be very thankful they do it without hesitation.
 

hortysir

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#2
Well the intelligence reports were bad, yes. But they were bad enough to fool the majority of the population.
Kerry, Clinton, et.al. were all in favor of invading Iraq.
I'm against a time-table/deadline. That just let's the insurgents know when they start back up again.
Don't like being there. But don't trust the cut-n-run strategy, either.
We're there now. And we're going to be there for a long time to come.
 

Flynn

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#3



Sunburst

Your post is exactly what is wrong with the war in Iraq.

You are more concerned about American troops rather than the citizens of Iraq.


 

Flynn

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#4



HS

Yes GW Bush did release information that fooled a lot of people.

That doesn't make those people stupid.

When the commander and chief of America says it is so, you tend to think he is telling the truth. Most people would also have believed that GW Bush had the best intel reports available.

GW Bush lied to American politicians and he lied to the world.



 

hortysir

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#5
He passed along information that was given to him. It was false information. And you can't say that he knew it was false.
This did go in front of the UN, remember? They believed it too. They just weren't as ready to act as other countries were.
And, HELL YES, I tend to care more about my fellow country-men than I do others. What's wrong with that?
 

squirt

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#6
here's your chance Flynn, we know what the issues are, how about a solution? surely you must have an answer on how to fix the mess in Iraq? I know it's not your mess, but that's beside this point!
 

hortysir

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#7
since this thread is more suited, I'll throw Flynn a bone here.
My step-son was over today and said you were right , Flynn...(2131 est, Thursday July 31, 2008, Hortysir told Flynn he was right) ;)
it wasn't drums of Sarin, and it wasn't early on that they found it.
It WAS early in-country they found the training camp.
This is the Sarin story:
********WONDER WHY YOU HAVEN'T HEARD ABOUT THIS?

If you use USATODAY.com - Operation Phantom Fury to visit the USA Today website you will be treated to a flash presentation of several pictures taken during the siege of Fallujah. Picture number two in this presentation shows 40 vials in boxes labeled "Sarin." That's Sarin gas, my friends. One drop of this stuff on your skin can kill you. The boxes have Cyrillic and German characters on them, indicating they may have come from our good friends the Russians or the Germans. The caption under the photo reads "Marines discovered 40 vials of suspected Sarin gas while searching a house in Fallujah, Iraq. It was secreted in a briefcase hidden in a truck in the courtyard of the house."

So ... there you go. Weapons of mass destruction. Chemical weapons. This Sarin gas could, with an effective application, kill thousands. And where do they find it? In a briefcase! A briefcase in a car trunk. And you wonder why our troops have had some difficulty finding Saddam's weapons? You still think inspections could have worked? Yeah, sure they would. The inspectors were going to look in every car trunk and every briefcase in Iraq. ********
 

hortysir

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#8
Marines capture suspected Iraqi terror training camp | Pierre Legrand's Pink Flamingo Bar

Monday, April 7, 2003
By Ravi Nessman, The Associated Press
SALMAN PAK, Iraq — The rusted shell of an old passenger jet sat out in a field, its tail broken off. Good for hijacking practice, U.S. Marines speculated Sunday as they examined an Iraqi training base about 20 miles south of Baghdad.The Americans also found a full obstacle course — with wooden walls and other barriers to be climbed over or crawled under — as well as a three-story concrete tower draped with ropes, apparently for rappelling.President Saddam Hussein’s regime has said the camp, part of a larger military reservation in a bend of the Tigris River, was used for anti-terrorism training for Iraqi special forces.
But U.S. officials and others have long suspected the camp trained terrorists. Two former Iraqi military officers told The New York Times and PBS’s “Frontline” in the fall of 2001 that Iraqis and non-Iraqi Arabs were brought here to practice hijacking planes and trains, planting bombs and staging assassinations.
 

Iceman

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#9
I am still not convinced there weren't any WMD. It is possible that while we were trying to get the support to go to Iraq, that they either moved the chemicals to Iran or burried them in the sand or one of their many caves..
 
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#11
Sunburst

Your post is exactly what is wrong with the war in Iraq.

You are more concerned about American troops rather than the citizens of Iraq.


[/SIZE]
I have friends who are joining the marines, that I would expect. Yes I am concerned for the Iraqis yet, they should be smarter than they are.
 

buttercups

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#12
[QUOTE="sunburstlespaulhero1989, post: 2404003]I have friends who are joining the marines, that I would expect. Yes I am concerned for the Iraqis yet, they should be smarter than they are.[/QUOTE]

You don't have to explain yourself to Flynn. He would critize whatever you wrote! lol
I feel bad about the innocent Iraq's but I feel worse for our troops that go over there and get killed.
 

Flynn

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#13
OK, for the benefit of the new members on the board I will re-state my opinion on the American invasion of Iraq.

A coalition of the willing should never have invaded Iraq, it was a criminal act.

Now that our troops have invaded the sovereign territory that is Iraq we have no other choice but to stay there and be the policeman on the block for how ever long it takes.

Yes it will take years to solve the problems that the American government caused by invading Iraq and it is Americans that should pay the cost of rebuilding Iraq.


[/SIZE]
 

buttercups

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#14
OK, for the benefit of the new members on the board I will re-state my opinion on the American invasion of Iraq.

A coalition of the willing should never have invaded Iraq, it was a criminal act.

Now that our troops have invaded the sovereign territory that is Iraq we have no other choice but to stay there and be the policeman on the block for how ever long it takes.

Yes it will take years to solve the problems that the American government caused by invading Iraq and it is Americans that should pay the cost of rebuilding Iraq.


[/SIZE]

With ALL the americans that are getting killed I think the americans have paid a big price!!
 
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#15
We should still fix things regardless, it is the right thing and Bush got us into this mess. I hope when it is fixed, whatever generation that is responsible for it thanks Bush for it and takes a dump on his lawn and or grave.
 

hortysir

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#16
Australia, a staunch U.S. ally and one of the first countries to commit troops to the war in Iraq five years ago, ended combat operations there Sunday June 1, 2008.
Remember my "cut-n-run" comment?
Leave the stupid Americans to clean up the mess that the stupid Americans made....
:sarcasm:
 

sybarite

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#18
[QUOTE="hortysir, post: 2404028]Remember my "cut-n-run" comment?
Leave the stupid Americans to clean up the mess that the stupid Americans made....
:sarcasm:[/QUOTE]

I was going to read to the end of this thread and look up info for the same thing and you beat me to it. Horty, you are such a good investigator!!!
:)
 

stevent222

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#19
Could never be anything like a Vietnam my friend besides VN was never a war it was a conflick. Again where a lot of good people died. I really don't have enough information on this hole Iraqi thing to really give a good comment on. I do know it started over oil, hench forth all the big oil cartels got involved and now upset. War is almost always dealing with money. If theres not a good one on no one gets richer.

War is also someplace that Old men that can't sit down and talk like rational about their differences and who is going to make more money then the other. Thats when they send in young men and women to DIE.

In my years I've seen way to much shit what humans can do to other humans. I am just happy that I've a roof and food everyday now. Don't drive so really could care less about gas prices.

And yes God bless or whomever you believe in to keep our troops safe just like the mothers are doing with there children that are on the other side too.

Shit like this always reminds me of Gullivers Travels. And I'd rather have a chat section of how should an egg be broken.
[/FONT]
 
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#20
Could never be anything like a Vietnam my friend besides VN was never a war it was a conflick. Again where a lot of good people died. I really don't have enough information on this hole Iraqi thing to really give a good comment on. I do know it started over oil, hench forth all the big oil cartels got involved and now upset. War is almost always dealing with money. If theres not a good one on no one gets richer.

War is also someplace that Old men that can't sit down and talk like rational about their differences and who is going to make more money then the other. Thats when they send in young men and women to DIE.

In my years I've seen way to much shit what humans can do to other humans. I am just happy that I've a roof and food everyday now. Don't drive so really could care less about gas prices.

And yes God bless or whomever you believe in to keep our troops safe just like the mothers are doing with there children that are on the other side too.

Shit like this always reminds me of Gullivers Travels. And I'd rather have a chat section of how should an egg be broken.
[/FONT]
I get where you are comming at. Yes, this is messed up and there are many good people being sent to do our politicians bidding.

The oil cartels seem pretty despirate to keep getting their money that is going to end one day. I hope people realize what is really going on rather than the lies that they are fed.